bil.dun Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Hello, I have a 1997 Deville, 84k miles, beautiful car. It ran great on the test drive, but after getting it home, and sitting overnight, it didn't want to start the next morning. After cranking for awhile, it eventually, and reluctantly started, and ran great after warmup. I did notice that the exhaust seemed VERY rich. I have since replaced the plugs, wires, added seafoam to the gas tank twice, and it has more power, and runs GREAT after starting, however it still doesn't want to start right away after sitting overnight, but will restart just fine once it's been running, or after the initial start. I wondered if, before putting lots of new parts in hoping to correct the starting problem, the coils could be at fault, or, maybe more likely could the ignition control module be bad? Or should I consider something else could be at fault? By the way, the service engine soon light does work, however is not illuminated....but before I did the tune up, it did come on momentarily (twice) before I did the tune up and added the seafoam. Any advice would be helpful, I love this car! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 The first thing to do with a 1992-2005 Cadillac with a noticeable issue is to run the OBD codes and write them down. Check the link in my signature block for a Caddyinfo page on how to do this. If there are no codes that tell you what the problem is, the next things to look for when you have hard starting and rich mixture are problems with the fuel pressure regulator (FPR) which can cause hard starting when hot (your problem is the opposite), fuel pump or fuel pump relay problems (seems likely here), leaking fuel injectors, or problems with the EVAP system. The OBD codes will tell you if the mixture is too rich or if there is a detectable problem with the fuel pump relay, so do that first. How about posting a picture or two of your new-to-you Cadillac? -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Ditto Jim. Do you hear the fuel pump prime when you turn the key to just the run position? If not, As a quick check, swap the ac relay and the fuel pump relay. It's under the hood in the fusebox. They are both exactly the same, and will help rule out a bad relay. If the relay is bad, the oil pressure pump acts as a relay when cranking pressurizes the oil pressure after a long crank, the car gets fuel. Did you ever see a message on the screen "service fuel system"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Thanks for your replies, C Jim and winterset.....I'll have the codes checked and compare them with your list, I'm not sure yet how to post pictures. And second, no I've never seen a "service fuel system" message on my dash....I know much less than you guys, but still feel it's an ignition problem...I've removed the 4 connectors to the ICM, cleaned and sprayed them with electronic cleaner, and it improved right away, although temporarily. Oh, by the way I forgot to mention, the car does run great all other times, and gets great gas mileage, like it should. I'll keep you posted, and let you know what happens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted September 14, 2015 Report Share Posted September 14, 2015 Check your connections at the left front strut tower, sometimes they get flaky. Very common culprit of a extended crank no start is usually fuel pump relay. could also have a clogged fuel filter. I highly suggest you get a fuel pressure tester and find out what the pressure is on a cold KOEO then try to start the engine. Anywhere between 47-53. 20s is no good, even 35 is not great. If you cycle key and pressure slowly builds to normal it is likely plugged filter GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 Guys, thanks a bunch for your help!!.......I wondered, where is the fuel pump relay located? Maybe I can check it out, or at least clean the connections...thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted September 16, 2015 Report Share Posted September 16, 2015 should be at the left front strut tower, under the black cover GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2015 * Hey guys, geez I feel stupid, I overlooked winterset's advice in post 2 for the location of the relay. Anyhow, I'm posting this update: I tried the relay switcheroo, and found the relay is fine. Also, I do hear the fuel pump buzzing in the tank. So, I ordered a FPR on the WWW, and in the meantime took out the old FPR, and noticed the little sediment filter was somewhat warped. I reinstalled it, and, this morning, it started up quite quickly!!....But I'm still not convinced the new FPR will solve the problem, I'll keep you guys posted after I install the new one. This is a great forum, and will surely have more questions in the future. I just recently bought a ' 99 Deville, a SERIOUS cream puff, with only 36k miles, super condition, never driven in snow OR rain, white with white vinyl top, like new blue leather interior. Drives like new, only problem is, the radio sucks, it's the am/fm cassette job, no CD. I NEED a CD player, am looking for a correct original replacement, i.e basic am/fm cassette (single) CD player. I know there are several radio combinations and wiring differences, and wondered if any of you guys have expertize in this area? And a quick footnote, my '97 has the am/fm cassette system with a 12 CD changer in the trunk, works and sounds awesome! But I know there is a lot of wiring from the radio to the trunk, and there must be different connections/plugs with this unit than my basic '99 radio. Thanks again for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted September 17, 2015 Report Share Posted September 17, 2015 I have multiple writeups on the 12 disc changer. A search should show them. Pull back the carpet in the corner of the trunk by the right taillight. If you see a flat plug with 7-8 wires you are plug and play. I have added the changer to my Cadillacs that were both prewired and not wired. Not prewired is alot more work though. Why would you think the FPR would not resolve your starting issue? GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Hi rockfangd! Sorry I didn't answer sooner! It turns out that I DO have the prewired setup to add the CD player...cool. So now all I need to do is get a used 12 disc changer and I'm good to go. But more importantly, I'm waiting to get my new FPR for the Caddy, and oddly enough, it still seems to start a lot better after sitting overnight, even though all I did was remove and replace the original...I didn't think a new FPR would work, because so many other folks have written in with the same issue and a new FPR didn't seem to solve the problem. HOWEVER, watch this post, as the item is ready for pickup at my PO and I should be installing it Monday after work, and will know the results Tuesday morning, will let you guys know the results ASAP! Thanks.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 They have devices like ipad2car or isimple for GM cars that plug into the port in the trunk, then you run the wire to the ipod, and you control the ipod from your radiohead (note: you will not see song titles on your screen, but you will see disk1 track1. I have never used one. I understand disk=playlist, and track=song# in playlist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 OK, so back again! It's Thu, and I have installed the new FPR, I wish all jobs were this easy! So the end result is that, yes, the new FPR did solve the problem, the car starts right up, and even seems to have a better response while driving. So, my problem is apparently solved, and I want to thank all you guys again. I'm still trying to get a 12 disc CD changer for my '99 Deville, and will keep posted (and posting) on this site, I think it's great! Good luck to all others out there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 I had a 96 Deville. If you want to improve your throttle response buy a can of GM upper engine cleaner use a lint free cotton towel and clean the heck out of the throttle body. Make sure you clean the throat all around and both sides of the throttle plate. Do NOT spray carb cleaner into the throttle body ever! We have seen a tech hydrolock his customers engine spraying carb cleaner into the TB and it pooled and rocketed into the nearest cylinder on acceleration, hydrolocked the engine and drove a rod through the side of the engine. Put the carb cleaner on your rag only. Use a rubber glove its a dirty job... take your time, hold the plate open to get the backside. A good cleaning will take 30 min. Let us know how it feels afterward Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 I have a spare changer if you might be interested. I pulled it from a 1999 Deville. GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bil.dun Posted September 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2015 Hi, thanks for your response...is it a 12 disc, #16199553, and in working condition? I'm interested, but only if it's reasonable, some of these are big bucks on ebay, at least they think they will get their high price, many don't even know if they work or not...!!?? Could you give me some more details, and a price? Thanks! Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted September 29, 2015 Report Share Posted September 29, 2015 give me til this weekend and I will send you pics and all. It worked fine when I pulled it. They are highly reliable units. I have not heard of one failing yet. GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted September 30, 2015 Report Share Posted September 30, 2015 Don't forget that the CD's must be upside down, the shiny side up and the label down, to play in the 12-CD player. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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